Et Tu Lemba


A ping sent out on Jabber yesterday sent shockwaves throughout the already war-ravaged Imperium. Lemba, a highly regarded bloc FC since February 2014, had betrayed The Imperium by leaking sensitive and classified information to the EVE subreddit under the name IllumittaniLeaks.

Traitor From: Twizzlespark Celes Sent: 2016.04.09 02:34 To: Goonswarm Federation, DOKDO, Today I come before you with a terrible news. I’ll keep it brief. GSF has been hunting for Director level spy, who has been getting more and more bold recently. This morning, with a cleverly crafted trap, we now have identified the spy. Lemba is the spy. It breaks my heart to say this, but the proof is overwhelming. We sent bait link to the leaker’s reddit account with a text file hosted from our side. When Lemba logged into the leaker account and clicked on the link’s text file and accessed the text file, we found the IP address to match that of Lemba’s. Here’s the proof. [IP information redacted] It disappoints me greatly to face up to the truth, but the proof is overwhelming. And however terrible the truth may be, DOKDO must go on. I have created corporation “I’m Fine and You aren’t”[D0KDO] and we are going to move there. We will have full support of Goonswarm Federation in the process and we will operate just as we have, sans Lemba. If you have supercapital in the corporation, keep it LOGGED OFF until it is safe for us to move them. You will bounce like a ping pong ball and will soon see gazillion supers and dreads on your head. We will arrange a safe transfer for your supers. Keep them LOGGED OFF. Apply to the new corporation with your Full API / verification key, and I will accept you shortly. The new corp is going to be in GSF in 24 hours. Don’t log in until we are in GSF when in new corp.

The Imperium’s Black Hand and IT departments are famous for their digital forensics capabilities and they had planted a very specific trap to ferret out the traitor. I reached out to them for comment, but it’s long standing policy that these departments do not discuss sources, methods or ongoing operations. What is known is that no personally identifying information was gathered or disclosed. However, in a Crossing Zebras exclusive. I was able to speak to the man at the center of this controversy. Lemba, DOKDO CEO, former FC and Illumittani member agreed to sit down with me on Skype to discuss the reasons for his betrayal, his views on World War Bee and the future of the Imperium.


Burnout and disaffection

The Lemba that I, and so many others in The Imperium remembered was a generally happy player, a brilliant fleet tactician and trusted member of The Illumittani, The Imperium’s coalition level director group. Was it burnout, dissatisfaction, change in command and diplomatic climate in The Imperium that caused the events behind today’s revelations? As it turns out, as is the case with most defections and treasonous acts, it was a combination of all of these things that led Lemba down the path of betrayal.

It was all of that. I was burned out from all the countless, meaningless wars. Going there putting my time into helping their cause while sacrificing my real life just to see those phat cats chomping down on food on a Yacht while I was working my ass off. Their ideology is completely screwed up and not inline with how I want to play.

Burnout for all FCs it is one jump away. Lemba, like any long-time FC started to feel the weight of daily strategic operations. FCs are generally resilient people, but every one of them has a breaking point. Speaking from experience in my career, in EVE Online and as a former Non-Commissioned Officer in the military, when the top doesn’t appear to be actively engaged in a given conflict, it breeds resentment automatically within the lower echelons of command. Lemba made it very clear that resentment of the executive leadership of The Imperium was a major factor in his acts of betrayal.  When I asked Lemba about this he outlined a situation not unlike some of the criticisms of American Presidents, senior political leaders essentially playing rounds of golf, partying, and generally not caring while the line troops were pushed to fight to the point of utter exhaustion. Lemba felt that The Mittani and others above him didn’t have any appreciation for the sacrifices in time and energy made by subordinate leaders and line members.

When we were in the war in the south, everyone was in the war from the top down. Everyone from mittens to blawrf to the lowest FC were communicating. This time it was mittens sending us out to war and taking the top generals out to play, which is a huge problem. It was just like that. Obama calling a huge war and then fucking off to the Caribbean.

It wasn’t as though Lemba didn’t want to fight. He had quickly earned a reputation in The Imperium as one of the most fight-hungry FCs in the entire coalition. He thought the wars in the south were a great idea for reasons he expanded on in our interview. For all of EVE, it was a time of change for the fundamental mechanics of null sec.

I liked the idea. It was fun because ProviBloc is really really good at banding together. So the CFC had a legit enemy to test the mechanics on.”

By the fall of 2015, Lemba had moved to the Republic of Korea and was working as an AUTZ FC. He left me with the impression that he felt overburdened and trapped doing the work of what would normally be divided amongst multiple skirmish and bloc level FCs. His personal life began to suffer under the strains of being one of a few AUTZ FCs that were active during the fall of 2015, when the low sec Viceroyalty operations that were launched shortly after the failure of TMC’s Kickstarter campaign to publish a book about the Fountain War.

My personal life was affected because there was no one else on the AUS timezone to do all the fleets required. So I spent too much time away from my family fighting his war. I felt terrible for the allies. On USTZ there are a lot of dudes to pass down fleets, not on AU”.

For Lemba, the breaking point wasn’t as simple as one thing, but a myriad of issues, seemingly left unaddressed by his leaders. Eventually this highly respected FC and Illumittani member hit his breaking point.

Their concept and idea of war. The yacht trip. Their plans to let allied alliances fall; everything about this war.

When the Viceroyalty campaign came to an end, Lemba was well and truly finished with The Imperium in all but name. Something stuck out during the follow up questions however. He claimed there was a plan by The Illumittani to let allies fall. So I asked him if there there any indications that this was their specific, intentional plan and if so, how long had the operational plan had been active for? His response seems to paint a picture of a rather feckless Illumittani directorate. One that was oblivious, or otherwise unconcerned about emergent threats.


Imperial hubris

People play EVE online for a lot of different reasons, and sometimes the reasons and desires of leaders don’t always match up with what the members and middle management want or need from New Eden. The divide between various leaders, and the plans Lemba suggested were being considered reminded me of a book written by former CIA Case Officer Michael F. Scheuer, Imperial Hubris. In the book, the former Station Chief lays out problems with U.S. policy. Discarding allies, a failure of policy makers to maintain situational awareness as the political and a changed military landscape all caused an evolving situation that no-one had a handle on. Finally it led to a near-total collapse of the intelligence community that directly attributed to 9/11. In New Eden, it’s quite possible to mimic such a situation, so I asked Lemba if he thought this is what had happened to The Mittani, Sion and other key Imperium leaders?

That’s a hell of a question. I think that the mittani makes enough money off the game that it clouds his own judgment. I think he thinks we are all still into the role playing, and we’re not. I think he is blind to the fact that the people are not happy with him, nor how this war is going. So he is disconnected. We just want to fight and they want the opposite.

Had the Illumittani members, including Lemba, changed? Or was it The Mittani and/or the top cadre of The Imperium whose attitudes had shifted toward the gameplay in EVE? Again, the answer was not as simple as one would think. Like a couple whose relationship is slowly dismantling, the disgruntled Illum members and The Mittani slowly drifted apart, until things were irreconcilable. Was there some way that The Mittani and others could have turned it all around? Was there a missed decision point that could have made World War Bee avoidable and preserved the vast empire of the northwest? Lemba went on to explain in greater detail.

I honestly just think they made too many enemies. The reddit propaganda train, the narrative, the ISK involved. It all builds up to where we are now. There is nothing they could have done I don’t think. Strategically they are surrounded and can’t do anything. The line members don’t want to do anything and are leaving. It’s a little of both. We (that left) just want to fight. Illum wants to live a legacy and write the empire.

Finally, the subject of abandoning those who knew Lemba best from his fleets came up. About a month ago IllumittaniLeaks started posting confidential Imperium information on r/eve. I wondered how Lemba felt about his treason, his betrayal of his friends and colleagues, and the line members who counted on him.


Lemba has been labeled a traitor to The Imperium by The Mittani, but does he view himself that way? Does he feel betrayed by The Imperium? Did Lemba feel justified in leaking confidential information to the general public of EVE, like Edward Snowden when he leaked classified NSA data? Did he believe that the betrayal of trust and assured enmity of The Imperium was worth it to expose what he saw as corruption, hubris, or at least negligence by The Mittani and other senior Imperium leaders? His response was brief and to the point.

Sure, I am a traitor. However I became a traitor because of the way the Illum/Imperium was going. I was tired of it and wanted to add fuel to the fire. I was stuck. I felt bad for the other folks that were affected by it all.

Looking forward, and given the serious pressure that The Imperium faces on both the Eastern and Southern fronts, Lemba’s outlook is bleak for the future of bloc as a null sec power. He sees a way back to greatness, but not without enormous difficulty and some reflection on how The Imperium develops as an entity going forward.

I think they will lose everything over the next month or so they will shrink member number wise and they will become what TEST was before all of this. They will gain some traction and may take a hack and sov again, but they need to seriously lighten up and just play the game or nothing’s going to change.

In closing what can we look forward to from Lemba in EVE Online, or is this an and to his time in New Eden? The short of it is that he will continue to write for TMC and he is not sharing his future plans. He confirmed it would spoil the fun if he did. I personally, like all loyal Imperium members, look forward to shooting Lemba in the face, but I’ll always remember the good times with him. While I can never agree with what he did, I can empathise with the pressures he faced in such a tough environment. Before we automatically knee-jerk and criticise, perhaps the most important unanswered question is ‘what would we do in the same situation’?

Tags: dodko, Imperium, lemba, viktor, World War Bee

About the author

Viktor Fel

Viktor is currently a member of Goonwaffe, and has actively not existed in the Reavers SIG since its founding in 2014. His EVE hobbies include aborting baby titans, making renters miserable, mass murder in space. You know, just Reaver things.

  • Rob Kaichin

    “What is known is that no personally identifying information was gathered or disclosed.”

    So, how did you know it was him, if you didn’t collect anything that could identify anyone?

    • Viktor Fel

      It is known, because of what was edited out, because of the sources and methods used by Imperium’s Counterintel team, and because of things I personally know about Lemba’s player that would land anyone attempting to conduct any sort of DOCX operation against him in federal prison for many years.

      • Rob Kaichin

        So personally identifying information was collected, to know it was him.

        • Viktor Fel

          No, I know him Rob. We’ve talked shop in comms channels in the past. Please, put the tinfoil down.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Not you, by the Black Hand and the GIA.

          • Viktor Fel

            I have no comprehension of how you came to such a baseless conclusion.




            gerund or present participle: doxxing

            search for and publish private or identifying information about (a particular individual) on the Internet, typically with malicious intent.

            So if he was doxxed, where’s all this personally identifying information that we can just go to a public site like wikileaks and sniff out?

            Oh, thats right, there isn’t any. If you find some I’d love to run the story, but so far what you claim don’t exist.

          • Rob Kaichin

            GIA felt certain enough to kick a director level spy.

            They did this by ascertaining the IP address of ‘the spy’, and comparing it to Lemba’s.

            Is an IP address not personally identifying information?

            I didn’t mention DOXXing, but keep pretending that I did.

          • Viktor Fel

            You do know that IP addresses are not Dox material right? In fact, I have yours and you have mine right now.

          • Rob Kaichin

            So now we’re retreating to the legal definition of things?

            Keep going there, friend, you’ve always got the law on your side.

          • Rob, you can’t be serious in saying that an IP address is personally identifiable information. That’s troll material right there.

          • Rob Kaichin

            I’m taking this from the ping that went out, with the associated posts by both sides.

            The IP address of the spy matched that of Lemba. This confirmed that the spy was Lemba. Therefore he was removed.

            I’m not trying to troll, I’m saying that any use of language outside a court room would find that the information personally identified Lemba in this situation as the spy.

            That’s what I’m trying to point out.

            Anyway, the number of members of GSF’s directors chat which live in Korea is hardly going to be that high.

          • digitalebola

            Yes, I know the law quite well, thank you. IP addresses are not PII. I can identify many people by their posting styles and the way they spell and punctuate… does not qualify as PII even though I can identify someone that way. Generally, PII and other protected datasets are a combination – one type is not always enough to be classified as PII but several are. A name and a social and a date of birth is considered PII, a DOB by itself is not, however I think it all goes grey when a social is by itself as the non-credentialed datauser has no way to cross reference the social to identify the owner BUT the social is often used as not only ID but PASSWORD as well, so it comes down to how and why the number was accessed or displayed in the first place. We did not think things through when we started using social security numbers and it will take ages to get to a identification system that is secure and makes sense. In the end, we WILL have to two factor it so yeah, if you are a bible thumper, your rapture is coming… and the rest of us can not worry about the many different overseas-based hacking groups that make their living by literally scooping millions of records for bulk sale.

            Back to you Rob: call it what you want, you’re wrong, you are not qualified to even discuss this topic but if you want to SJW yourself around, by all means. I would be more than happy to lay my sword down if everyone laid theirs down too… but that’s not the case and I have no disillusions that you would rape your mother to get ahead in this stupid video game. Tell her hi for me, please.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Well, aren’t you nice :).

            ” I would be more than happy to lay my sword down if everyone laid theirs down too… but that’s not the case”

            Who is the Digi of Voltron?

            Who is the Digi of Test?

            Whilst you’re fabricating those people, please also answer this questions:

            Did the GIA use an IP address captured in a ‘trap’ to identify a person in this situation?

            The answer is ‘Yes’. The majority of people, who aren’t obsessed by knowingly skirting the bounds of legality, would find that the IP address, in this case, could be described as ‘Personally Identifying Information’.

            It must be tough to admit that, having surrounded yourself with the filth and detritus of the game world, you have no belief in innate human goodness, but rest assured. I’m not a nasty guy.

            If I was as obssessed with self aggrandisement as your ‘friends’, (because they use you so much more than you use them), I would’ve taken 60 bil from the corp wallet when people gave me access, or taken 50 bil in ships. Or I would’ve lit a cyno on one of the various super killing ops I’ve been on, and brought in your super fleet to get some kills for a tasty price.

            But I didn’t, and I won’t. Because I know that this is a game, and you don’t .

            But let’s go back to your bigger problem. The sinking realisation that despite all you’ve done; doxxing people, outing people, trying (ineffectually) to menace those who disagree with you and your methods, your side is losing.

            Keep telling yourself you’re the boogeyman, the shield in the darkness, the protector.

            You were the villain all along.

          • digitalebola

            I don’t know who CI of TEST/Voltron is currently. I don’t care. There is usually someone and I’ve hunted spies for them before they turned into rotten babbys.

            As far as the trap, it was a standard low-hanging fruit technique and there is nothing even close to skirting the law or nothing even magical: I have your IP address because system logs and all I need is the match that correlates to the identity in question. That’s it. If you want to tell me that system logging is WRONG or BAD or IMMORAL, go right ahead and make an even larger fool of yourself. Even your TESTS and your VOLTRONS log IP addresses as a natural course of business.

            Oh, I should tell you that I don’t care if my side loses. If my side loses, I lose with the people that I have spent at least seven years of my life with. Playing computer games, drinking with them, vacationing with them, arguing with them and crying with them. My friends. A loss in a video game doesn’t change those things and in the past, has only served to strengthen us. Yeah, I’m the boogeyman, theres a ton of myth and narrative to what I do but make no mistake, it can be dirty and tasteless. I was called a “necessary evil” by a CIO of a 4 billion dollar a year company and that’s fairly accurate. If you want things to change, go ahead and tell CCP to ban the metagame. No more spies, no more thefts, no more digis. Do it.

          • Rob Kaichin

            ” If you want to tell me that system logging is WRONG or BAD or IMMORAL”

            Well, that’s not what I said. I’m saying that anything which could lead to real life hard is wrong. Things like outing someone, or reading out their real life address, which you’ve proudly admitted to doing.

            I don’t give a crap that GIA monitored someone’s IP address, I give a crap that they pretend that they didn’t, and retreat to ‘well it ain’t the legal definition’ when confronted.

            IP monitoring = dodgy, but not bad by itself.

            IP monitoring + Personal information collecting + dissemination of that information to people with the ability to do things about it in real life = bad.

            Is there a person in Voltron or TEST who’s led personal character attacks on their enemies? That’s what my “Who is Voltron’s Digi?” meant.

            If there is, tell us. If there isn’t, don’t pretend that you’re protecting someone from a non-existent threat.

            Because if there is no one else like you, you’re not a ‘necessary evil’, you’re just plain evil.

          • digitalebola

            I’ve been called worse by better. Trust me buddy, you haven’t seen evil yet.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Show us then.

          • Endie

            What digi is describing is matching the ip of a spy against the known IP of a hostile. Everyone in eve does that if they care about spies. It is not doxxing. It is not creepy. Every messageboard shows the same information to admins so they can also match up sockpuppets etc the same way.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Like I said below, I’m protesting the weasel-word denial that no personally identifying information (as informed by the legal definition, with no recourse to colloquial understanding from any other party) was gathered or disseminated.

            I don’t like IP address collecting. I think that any use of it that isn’t spy catching should be challenged.

            If they didn’t feel the need for using that legal term to imply that no information was collected, none of my posts would be here :P.

          • digitalebola

            PS… you probably shouldn’t use TEST as your example of right: (11:53:04 PM) Montolio: ::ffff:

          • Fearlesslittletoaster

            There is a legal definition of PI for a reason. It refers specifically to information that could cause somebody harm by facilitating identity theft. I mean 100% grade A trolling, but you don’t get to re-define terms like that.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Ok, so there’s a specific legal term. Is this a court room, or any other area where arbitration, or any other such legal dealings might occur?

            Would you agree that there are colloquial usages of language too?

            Edit: and could you show me some evil too?

          • Fearlesslittletoaster

            I would, but in this case they do not apply. The way you are trying to use personally identifiable information in this context is loaded with meaning beyond what you claim it is.

            Hypothetically, if you came out of this able to say, “I got Digi to admit he identified Lemba by gathering personally identifiable information!” with an out of context quote to support that any reader not familiar with this thread would draw a misleading conclusion. And that, right there, is my central problem with what you are trying to do.

            As for the evil, sorry to disappoint but this is a silly spaceship computer game. It doesn’t rate; at best I be a bit of a grammar Nazi or a pedant.

          • Rob Kaichin

            My intention is to say “Lemba was identified by using information specific to him”. By using a colloquial form of words to communicate that information, I seem to hit a nerve.

            My problem is that the initial article, *not* a legal brief or article, is apparently using a specific series of words in a *100% legal meaning and usage only* way.

            If the article was edited to read “by tracing Lemba’s IP address and confirming it matched that of the spy”, not “What is known is that no personally identifying information was gathered or disclosed”, then I’d be happy.

            “Hypothetically, if you came out of this able to say, “I got Digi to admit he identified Lemba by gathering personally identifiable information!” with an out of context quote to support that any reader not familiar with this thread would draw a misleading conclusion. And that, right there, is my central problem with what you are trying to do.”

            That’s not what I’m trying to do, and if I’ve miscommunicated that anywhere, I’d be happy to edit my post to make my intentions clear.

          • Fearlesslittletoaster

            I think editing your posts would be overkill, clarification like this works just fine. I mean really who is reading this besides the two of us at this point?

            And yes, the way you used PI did hit a nerve because the term comes loaded with legal and cultural meaning that carries negative connotations for people. It would be like me declaring that people arguing on the internet are now called child molesters and then calling you a pedophile based on my new and arbitrary definition. Anyone not aware of the fact that I just decided to assign a completely new meaning to the word would likely draw some awful conclusions about you.

          • Rob Kaichin

            “And yes, the way you used PI did hit a nerve because the term comes loaded with legal and cultural meaning that carries negative connotations for people.”

            I don’t mean to be rude, but to me (and probably most people) it really doesn’t carry the meaning (with all the connotations and weight) you’re saying it does.

            (Which, if I wanted to pick a fight, I’d point out is kinda dodgy in and of itself)

          • Fearlesslittletoaster

            Perhaps, but for those is is a very loaded term indeed. Unfortunately sometimes language needs precise definitions because the choice of words alone can cause consequences for people.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Oh, absolutely.

          • Kamar Raimo

            Either you are bating him now or you are really overstating your case. I know few things about internet privacy stuff, but one thing I know: recording someone’s IP address is not doxxing,

          • Rob Kaichin

            I don’t ever recall saying that Lemba was doxxed. Perhaps someone told you otherwise?

            In this situation, Lemba was identified by his IP address.

            A person was identified, by the information specific to him (at that time).

            How was that information not personally identifying?

      • Gerald Hollis

        I am super confused by all the hate flowing Rob’s way. Maybe it doesn’t meet the legal definition but the fact is that he was personally identified as the spy from his IP. Sure, maybe it wouldn’t be enough for a court of law but it was good enough for the Black Hand. And the only person referring Doxxing was Victor. Sounds like someone has a guilty conscience.

        • Rob Kaichin

          Thank you for your support.

          Consider the evasions par for the course.

  • Rob Kaichin

    Could we see the whole transcript of the interview too?

    • Viktor Fel

      Rob, there were things in Skype discussed off record. I know wikileaks, log dumping, and other assorted requests are all the rage on the internets these days, and in EVE. However, I am not going to compromise an interview source for any reason. Dumping conversation logs of any type would do just that.

      • Rob Kaichin

        Wow, have you confused what I was saying.

        I’m looking for the transcript of the interview, not the entire channel script.

        • Do you even know what a transcript is? Or do you think that *reading* it as a transcript, which would be what was said in the channel script written word for word, makes it completely different?

          Rob, why is your English so low?

          • Rob Kaichin

            ‘so low’, you mean so poor :P.


            Something which has been transcribed; a writing or composition consisting of the same words as the original; a written copy.”

            So I think my first usage was good.

            “script ‎(plural scripts)

            A writing; a written document.”

            I’ll accept that my second usage wasn’t so distinct. I’ll therefore ask that you reinterpret it using the word ‘transcript’ or ‘entire channel’s content’.

            I’m sure it was perfectly understandable anyway, but don’t worry.

          • So you were able to copy the words in the definition of transcript, but still do not understand what it means.

            If a person refuses to release an entire channel’s content because some of the information is not meant to be read by the public (not all conversations between people who have known each other for a long period of time are concerned with EVE alone; it is entirely possible that personal, real-life conversations are in there, too.), then why would you expect them to release the exact same information, word-for-word, in the form of a transcript?

            Clearly, you do not actually understand what a transcript is, even if you are able to parrot a dictionary definition. If you did understand, you would not have bothered asking for transcripts in the first place.

          • Rob Kaichin

            Obviously there’s part of the text which contains ‘the interview’, and there’s part of the text which contains ‘not the interview’.

            I guess you might be struggling here, so here’s what I said*:

            “I’m looking for the transcript of the interview, not the entire channel transcript”

            Unless this interview was completely informal, which I’d be surprised by, as Lemba’s answers were pulled out in block form, it should be simple enough to work out where Viktor asked a question and Lemba answered.

            *allowing for my second edit, which you apparently did. (And then failed to read)

          • Clearly, you do not understand the concept. The interview + not the interview = the entire channel transcript.

            So, really, all you want is the interview part? That’s easy. Here you go.

            How is it that you couldn’t find this and still managed to post a comment on this asking if this could be posted for you? Congrats on essentially trolling yourself.

          • Rob Kaichin

            What questions did Viktor ask?

  • GrouchyOldGamer

    Portraying whistle-blowers as traitors #EndieWasRight

    • Arrendis

      By the way, Lemba’s still going to be writing about EVE events over at TMC. I’m hoping he’ll be willing to tell his side of the story in greater detail over there.

  • nosov

    ‘His personal life began to suffer…’, some questionable dudes doing boat trips at the cost of eve players(?) et cetera. This all looks so bizarre and unreal i can hardly believe we are playing the same game.

    • Montolio Was Right

      Goon philosophy is fun-denying and relies on their minions not valuing their own time.

      The dumb minions tried for a long time deluding themselves that they “like playing this way” and that “it;s about the empires for us, not the space content”. In the end they wake up one by one and realise it’s not a glorious empire, it’s just 15 bucks paid for be bored out of your mind.

  • schwaboy

    Lemba is full of shit. He was leaking before the Mexico trip. And anywhere he goes, he will probably leak there too

    • Rob Kaichin


  • callduron


    Man’s a goddam hero.

    It’s your afk directors who do nothing while everything burns who are the traitors.

  • Rolfski

    CFC denying real fights heavily boomerangs on their morale. Say about Lemba what you think, but this analysis has already proven to be true over and over again in this war sofar.

    • grunt

      A big victory is probably impossible at this point. But one doesn’t always have to win in order to get content.

      Imperium has no lack of funding. What it lacks is morale and fleet participation. Ramp up the SRP, give members real boats to fly (Machs, not Caracal meatshields). So what if they come out fleet kb red, individual members will still be kb green and happy. Open the purse and exchange isk for membership/fleet participation. What do they plan to do with the isk when they have no members left?

      • Rolfski

        Agreed, winning battles is not the same as winning hearts & minds.
        In the end, they probably win more/loose less if they give their line members what they want and let them lose spectacular space battles, just for the lulz of it and showing off their endless SRP pockets. It will also gain them a lot more respect within the Eve community for bringing it on.

      • Montolio Was Right

        They are carebears through and through, and the best thing a carebear lies to see is the wallet going up and never going down. Applies the same to an alliance leader as to a mission runner.

        Like the old NC they will remain misers until the end, making hordes of money and but grasping onto it all jealously, and making their members fly the same shit doctrines from 3 years ago.

        If they could do as you say then well, they wouldn’t be goons in the first place.

    • Montolio Was Right

      They won’t get anything. They will remain risk-averse, fun-denying, content-denying, boredom-weaponizing cunts until the very bitter end. But then that’s why we fight, to stamp the life out of this cancerous dumb shit way of playing computer games.

      The CFC needed big victories A YEAR AGO before it drove away its best people and its active people. Unfortunately the only way to win-big is to take big risks. CFC not only avoided big risk, it avoided even the most infinitesimal risk. Even in engagements they could clearly win they still avoided because there remained a 1% uncertainty of the outcome. “Helldunks or blueballs” spelled out by one of their FCs.

      They literally bored themselves to death.

  • Niko Lorenzio

    Good article. Thank you.

  • Jarhead

    “Rommel insisted that Hitler be arrested and brought to trial for his crimes”

    great generals have a history of stnading up for their people.


    Dear sir or madam,

    You have mis-spelled Illuminati. It has never been spelled like that once by anyone except Lemba.

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