CZ Minutes: Power Points

It’s been a tumultuous week, and as the dust begins to settle, support remains strong and persistently growing for the potential future these nullsec changes will bring. We’ve written about it with Manny here on CZ, it’s been written about elsewhere, and it’s been the talk of the town all week. So let’s keep that going. Folks, what are you most looking forward to about this expansion, that isn’t something that’s an obvious consequence? Niden, for example, cannot say “well PL won’t keep me from flying cruisers” – we want to know what amazing and unexpected things you dream of seeing six months or a year from now in EVE? Do you want to see a more immersive, localized nullsec experience? Do you want to see more roaming? What crazy thing are you most looking forward to trying as the next six months completely redefines what it means to play EVE in low and nullsec? Oh Takashawa: So I’ve been a big fan of these changes pretty much since the beginning, with some exceptions – I’m hesitant about the JF changes in the absence of meaningful changes to make local self-sufficiency remotely viable – but overall, I’m happy. I think the thing I’m most excited about can be summed up with a picture, linked to me by Georgik Sojik during an E-Uni Q&A I hosted last night about these changes. Manfred Sideous, JEFFRAIDER, and several other PL bros were good enough to come by and spend almost 90 minutes sharing our excitement about this with new players. It was a great event, and a recording of it, can be found in this post. During the event, Georgik dropped a link to this old sov map, from May 2007. hoE0g1j We don’t know enough to know whether or not that will be a reality in a year – I doubt we’ll see quite that degree of fragmentation, at least not right away – and there are certainly coalition-type activities reflected on that map, and vast space empires. There are also, however, half a dozen or more brushfire wars I can distinctly remember from that time, where a constellation or even a single system is at issue. I want more of that. I want more choices in my content, I want more places to go to shoot a greater variety of people, and I am most excited that CCP is at last taking the first steps toward giving us a chance, just a chance, to once again enjoy an EVE universe as diverse as that one. As a final thought to those who remain firmly opposed to these changes, I would direct you to the description of the now-destroyed Monument outside Jita IV-4, which reminds players that “the ruins of this once-great work of art stand as a testament to the fact that change is the universe’s only constant.”
“I hope for more fleet engagements which become meaningful tactical affairs”
Tarek: Apart from the hopes expressed by Oh Takashawa, which I share, I would hope for bolder and more tactical mid-range fleet engagements. Earlier today I heard a presentation of Corebloodbrothers at EVEsterdam where he said they have a one-siege-cycle policy for dreadnaught engagement because they can simply not risk more before they are hotdropped from every direction. This is only one example of the risk aversity that results from long-range force projection. I hope for more fleet engagements which become meaningful tactical affairs more than just a competition in who can rageping more people to log in and drop on the grid. Wars which ideally become protracted campaigns for multiple smaller fleets and with higher strategic importance for black ops fleets. Of course I also hope that the measures needed to make nullsec more logistically and industrially independent soon follow the changes announced in the latest devblog. Hendrick: There’s been a fair bit of bruhaha over how these changes will “kill coalitions” and the “blue donut” of EVE. One thing people tend to forget is, yes even back before the fall of B.o.B. there were coalitions. They weren’t sprawling half the physical map but they were still a thing. Goons were part of a coalition with Tau Ceti Federation & Red Alliance (aka Red Swarm Federation, makers of some of the best EVE propaganda). We’re likely not going to see people like CFC backstabbing each other on November 4th, but more so refining themselves into more consolidated and compact space. Though there are claims that they won’t lose any of their foothold on Nullsec. They currently own somewhere around a dozen regions, the likelihood that they can keep all of them during the aftermath of these, and other hinted at changes to Sov, is unlikely but still a possibility. Personally, the talk around the Pandemic Legion watercooler is the hope to a return to “the old days, the bad days, the all or nothing days” where the reliance of Nullsec entities having sprawling renter alliances for their income isn’t as easy at it currently is. Some people are mocking this mentality as “glory day” posters, and idealists. While it’s rather silly to assume that “things are going to be just like 2007”, with these proposed limitations on capitals and supers, mixed with a more “chaotic” Nullsec, and adding in the UI and other simple improvements to player quality of life, it certainly is something to get excited about as a potential outcome. Only time will tell as the rest of the Nullsec related changes are released and refined. People have also been suggesting, via various examples and rumors, that the CFC are scared about these changes (mostly due to the Jump Bridge nerf). I am not overly confident they’re scared, but utterly annoyed would be an apt description to the comments I’ve seen. One thing that I recall from internal discussions, and this article, over at was that The Mittani, figurehead of the CFC, felt that capitals and super capitals should require subcapital support fleets. The use of the real world naval fleet in the spotlight image was chosen deliberately to showcase that concept in a subtle manner. With these changes, we’ll likely see a push towards this behavior. Stuff like freighter escort fleets (which were apparently a thing before I really got into EVE in 2009) are, in a way, coming back. The proposed changes are, in effect, achieving to curb the reliance on the “apex force” that was for the course of about a month the main talking point on his mind and nudging players towards being more reliant on subcapitals. (Note: I’m still contractually obligated to mention “apex force” in any EVE related writing I partake in.) Regarding how the CFC, N3, PL, etc. will behave with their sov post-Phoebe, if there is no change to the current mechanics in taking sov (i.e. Dominion-style warfare), most of the Nullsec entities can likely keep their current regions.  However this is only Phase 1 of, if I remember correctly, three stages to rework Nullsec. During an EVE University Q&A, JEFFRAIDER said “Good on you if you’re a renter up in Cobalt Edge and decide to say screw PL and Brothers of Tangra and try and secede and make your own little empire after these changes come out.” The ability for a group like PL, or CFC, or the N3 to quickly and easily deploy to stomp out that uprising just got harder making the ability for these new pockets of independent people not reliant on one of the two major coalitions to help them, much more possible to thrive.
“I’m hopeful we can see more border skirmishes and fighting over sov between new and old groups alike”
Personally I’m hopeful we can see more border skirmishes and fighting over sov between new and old groups alike as it makes my job doing the Nullsec Recaps each month more entertaining and more diverse in content. For example, the recap for September predominantly covered only three systems in Northern Catch which Provibloc and HERO Coalition were fighting over. Three systems throughout an entire month were the focus of Nullsec’s warring. That probably isn’t at all what CCP envision for Nullsec behavior.
Dirk: It’s been a really long time since I’ve had a chance to be a newbie in Eve so I’m excited at the prospect of being able to learn the game and the tactics all over again. Aside from being sad about Blops potentially being nerfed after only recently being given a lovable buff, and the premature JF nerf, I am 100% behind the changes. Xander: I mean, my worries are aligned with most of those the others mentioned above. But the overall plan to make 0.0 ‘bigger, for more smaller, more localised fights, for forcing blue lists to become less relevant? All fantastic and achievable goals. What excites me most about these changes? What the 0.0 map is going to look like next summer. Whether you like all the changes, some of the changes, none of the changes doesn’t alter the fact that the sovereignty landscape of nullsec is about to see a seismic shift and how wars develop and fights happen is going to take a huge period of adaptation. Bring it on.  
Tags: cz minutes, power projection

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Oh Takashawa

Oh Takashawa enjoys smugness, spaceships, and burning unnecessary amounts of helium isotopes.

  • Kinis Deren

    I believe the JD nerf opened the sov door for several independent alliances. I fully expect several active flash points to emerge very soon after Pheobe hits.Will the coalitions attempt to defend or will they just abandon systems? I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.

    I’ll be very interested to see what happens to the weaker alliances within the main coalitions. For instance, LAWN are universally recognized as being very weak without their CFC brethren to provide teleport back up. Might LAWN be kicked from CFC as a lost cause or will member corps be absorbed within other CFC alliances?

    As an opening first shot CCP has shaken the null hegemony to the core. One hopes that additional changes to alliances & sov itself will turn the hegemony into a fractured chaotic mess, rich in pew pew & content for all.

    • Messiah Complex

      “…or will member corps be absorbed within other … alliances?”

      I expect you’ll see a lot of that in the coming year. The new ‘renters’ are going to be those without the organization and the manpower to run adequate logistics operations to and from the trade hubs. The most powerful entities are going to control all the 0.0 systems within jump range of a quick low to high sec entry point. Weaker entities are going be pushed outward, and will need a pipe of blue systems to get to Empire.

  • Messiah Complex

    You might also see some of the balance of trade moving from Jita to Amarr, and some minor trade hubs grow into major ones over time.

    Y-MPWL and KBP7-G in Providence are relatively close to Amarr (9 and 10 high sec jumps, respectively), and Agil – currently a minor hub – is only four HS jumps from HED-GP in Catch.

    Piak, with 10 stations, is sort of a crossroads between EC-P8R (in Pure Blind), Black Rise, and Jita. That might become a hub, too.

    PF-346 in Syndicate is only seven HS jumps to Dodixie, but Syndicate is still Syndicate.

    The South is actually looking pretty good right now, and it’s entirely possible that Amarr could become the new Jita before long. Rens and Hek, on the other hand, may become even more of a backwater than they are now.